SUMO logging

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scheff
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SUMO logging

Post by scheff » Sun Apr 21, 2019 9:49 pm

I'm looking for information about SUMO logging.
  1. Where does SUMO store its logs?
  2. Which options are available to configure SUMO logging?
    (I'm only aware of the configuration option to turn on or off debug mode which I think may have an impact on logging although nowhere seen documented.)
  3. Which kinds of logs does SUMO support?
  4. To which extent data of the communication between SUMO client and server can be logged resp. which kind of meta data can be retrieved from the SUMO server?
There are different use cases where additional information is available but not reported. For those applications detected locally by SUMO I'd like to know
  1. how many SUMO users have the same application installed
    (I know this information is available on the SUMO server. But what to do to include this information in a report or log?)
  2. how many SUMO users have the same version of the application installed
    (I know this information is available on the SUMO server. But what to do to include this information in a report or log?)
  3. what's the threshold for the concerning application which will start available updates reported
  4. in case of available updates since when is the update version reported is available
    (In case such information is not available, then since when SUMO knows that the reported update version as available.)
  5. how many SUMO users have the proposed update version of the application installed
    (I know this information is available on the SUMO server. But what to do to include this information in a report or log?)
I also want to be able to
  1. see logs (and reports) of SUMO not just for one session but for every session (in order to analyse for trends over time or changes over sessions),
  2. eventually be able to cleanup such logs and reports by information I consider less interesting
I could not yet find how to proceed to get this information. I'm running version 5.8.12.415 of SUMO. The storage place reported several years ago in the forum does not exist on my device although another application is using the corresponding file system tree. And also in the Windows event database, I couldn't find any entry for KC Softwares, DUMO or SUMO. I'm running Windows 10 1809.

Kyle_Katarn
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Re: SUMO logging

Post by Kyle_Katarn » Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:13 pm

Logs are stored in c:\Users\<user>\AppData\Roaming\KC Softwares\SUMo
Only current session's log is stored. Previous session automatically erased.
Only option currently is "debug mode" which allows more verbose logging, for troubleshooting purpose mainly.

scheff
Posts: 71
Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:00 pm
Location: DE

Re: SUMO logging

Post by scheff » Tue Apr 23, 2019 2:20 pm

Kyle_Katarn wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:13 pm
Logs are stored in c:\Users\<user>\AppData\Roaming\KC Softwares\SUMo
I read this claim already before in another threat. But on my notebook, I could find directory c:\Users\<user>\AppData\ which had a single sub directory. None had a name "KC Softwares", "SUMO", nor "Roaming". It belonged instead to another application! In its subtree I couldn't find a log file of SUMO neither. I could also find directory c:\Users\<user>\Roaming\ which had a single sub directory Intel. None had the names "KC Softwares", "SUMO", "AppData", nor "Roaming". In its subtree I couldn't find a log file of SUMO neither.
Kyle_Katarn wrote:
Mon Apr 22, 2019 5:13 pm
Only current session's log is stored. Previous session automatically erased.
Only option currently is "debug mode" which allows more verbose logging, for troubleshooting purpose mainly.
  • At which moments this storing happens?
  • How do you know it's really stored in the file system, not just scheduled for later storage there, under which runtime and system context requirements?
  • Do I understand correctly that the session log will not be erased on close of the session but on start of a new session?
SUMO exports its log on request in currently up to 2 formats and automatically opens it on export via operating system standard application without asking for an alternate mode of behaviour nor alternate browsing application although Microsoft does so in its operating system and several of its applications. Please clarify. If my understanding is correct, at least a subset about multi-session storage and cleanup might be done by scripting outside SUMO and a wrapper around the application.

Kyle_Katarn
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Re: SUMO logging

Post by Kyle_Katarn » Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:59 pm

Regarding the localisation problem, what's the OS you're running ? Look at the system environment variable to locate user directory.
SUMo stores the log at program closure in normal mode OR at every log item if in debug mode (in order to easy SUMo crash investigations)
There is indeed only one format (verbose or not).

Multisession log is not possible yet. Could be a good idea. I encourage you to open a Mantis feature request for this one :)

scheff
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Location: DE

Re: SUMO logging

Post by scheff » Tue Apr 23, 2019 7:43 pm

Kyle_Katarn wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:59 pm
Regarding the localisation problem, what's the OS you're running ? Look at the system environment variable to locate user directory.
On the device with observation of this phenomen, I'm running Windows 10 Professional 1809 64 bit. I didn't need to look at the system environment variable. Browsing with windows explorer directs me into the right direction.
Kyle_Katarn wrote:
Tue Apr 23, 2019 6:59 pm
SUMo stores the log at program closure in normal mode OR at every log item if in debug mode (in order to easy SUMo crash investigations)
As SUMO takes quite some time, several minutes to start, I usually keep it open for a long time, as long as SUMO does not yet support command line mode. (With the size of my software application library and the tasks SUMO does on start, it still takes about 3 to 6 minutes on my fast device.) So not having closed SUMO at the time of investigation explains that the new session log is not yet written and the old one already erased.

Kyle_Katarn
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Re: SUMO logging

Post by Kyle_Katarn » Wed Apr 24, 2019 8:10 pm

3-6 minutes is very unusual. May I know how many apps and are they all local (or on network drives) ?

scheff
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Location: DE

Re: SUMO logging

Post by scheff » Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:59 pm

The number of applications is somehow dynamic on my device. Currently, SUMO reports more than 600 applications although I've disabled beta software as well as Microsoft Products and although SUMO doesn't find all applications. They're all local on SSD attached via PCIe. When restarting SUMO later, it seems that SUMO runs a bit quicker but still at least 2,5 minutes.

I was taking my first look at Windows PowerShell today. It reports almost 190 applications installed via Windows Installer. That's almost 50% more than Windows shows in its program list. It does also include entries difficult to detect and report otherwise.

Kyle_Katarn
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Re: SUMO logging

Post by Kyle_Katarn » Thu Apr 25, 2019 9:25 pm

scheff wrote:
Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:59 pm
The number of applications is somehow dynamic on my device. Currently, SUMO reports more than 600 applications although I've disabled beta software as well as Microsoft Products and although SUMO doesn't find all applications. They're all local on SSD attached via PCIe. When restarting SUMO later, it seems that SUMO runs a bit quicker but still at least 2,5 minutes.

I was taking my first look at Windows PowerShell today. It reports almost 190 applications installed via Windows Installer. That's almost 50% more than Windows shows in its program list. It does also include entries difficult to detect and report otherwise.
Thanks ! That's a kind a extreme use case :-)
On my dev station, I only have 51 items.... much faster :-)

scheff
Posts: 71
Joined: Tue Apr 16, 2019 3:00 pm
Location: DE

Re: SUMO logging

Post by scheff » Wed May 08, 2019 3:50 pm

Kyle_Katarn wrote:
Thu Apr 25, 2019 9:25 pm
scheff wrote:
Wed Apr 24, 2019 9:59 pm
The number of applications is somehow dynamic on my device. Currently, SUMO reports more than 600 applications although I've disabled beta software as well as Microsoft Products and although SUMO doesn't find all applications. They're all local on SSD attached via PCIe. When restarting SUMO later, it seems that SUMO runs a bit quicker but still at least 2,5 minutes.

I was taking my first look at Windows PowerShell today. It reports almost 190 applications installed via Windows Installer. That's almost 50% more than Windows shows in its program list. It does also include entries difficult to detect and report otherwise.
Thanks ! That's a kind a extreme use case :-)
On my dev station, I only have 51 items.... much faster :-)
No. I don't think this an extreme case. It depends on purpose resp. usage and infrastructure. I don't have a development platform installed although parts for support of scripting not yet used much. I currently don't have much of IT infrastructure here at home although I might start experimenting a bit into this direction. When I was working as an embedded software developer decades ago, the company used open source development suites adapted by software houses in cooperation with hardware manufacturers as cross-plattform development suite with individually commercialized and packaged component sets, no cloud service and just a few services run by data center services (like pay roll, accounting, email, some storage and backup service, firewall and identity management). So there were a lot more software tools and applications installed which I could not afford privately, neither in software investment nor in hardware investment.

Now with Microsoft Product reporting enabled in SUMo and with extension of scanning to portable software, I'm in the order of much more than 1400 software tools reported by SUMo although Windows reports of about 140 plus about 50 Windows 10 Apps. With such a limited configuration set, it started to enter an order for which design questions become relevant how you store which kind of information locally, which kind of information is exchanged with SUMo server and how all this gets organized.
  • Do you use some local database for the SUMo client?
  • And if yes, starting with which data volume does it use indexing and prefetching of its IO?
  • Starting with which data volume do you start bulk transfers between client and server?
Due to some other bug reports and questions you asked me to enable debugging for logging. As I already replied, the interesting information is hidden by default with such a data volume as it is cut out. And as far as I know, I don't have tools installed to take advantage of the possibility to clone file writing (like the tool tee) in the debug mode of SUMo. Does SUMo use the same resource limits in debug mode as in standard mode or what's the relation otherwise?
For such data volumes this would be a bad idea. In such a case the available resources should be multiplied at least by a factor of four or even better become configurable, regardless if via GUI or another UI reserved for advanced users eventually directed by KC Software support. Take a look at Apache configuration files which are commented.

Kyle_Katarn
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Re: SUMO logging

Post by Kyle_Katarn » Wed May 08, 2019 5:44 pm

First of all, there is no "bulk transfert" from client to server, only protocolar exchange to fetch up to date version for each entry. With 1400 entries, this would probably take a LOT of time. I'll see how I can implement optimization at protocol level to handle with more performance.

On client side, all data used at run time are stored in memory, we do not use any "database" management system. For cold data storage, we rely on file system in order to have the program list automatically restored when SUMo is loaded.

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